IF and that is a big IF...Ole Roy Williams makes it past Villanova and then by either Tom Izzo or Jim Calhoun, would a second title push the UNC coach past Coach K in the pantheon? I know I've had this discussion before and I had it again last night with Daddio and my brother-in-law.
I say that another title would put Roy along side Coach K, despite the fact that K and Duke has three titles to Roy's current one and possibly two. My argument remains that K won it with two teams. The back-to-back in 1991 and 1992 champs were the SAME team, then he went one decade later and took the 2001 team with a different team. Yes, three titles, but two teams. K has also been to three more title games, going 0-3 (1990 with same team as title teams, then in 1994 and in 1999). Meanwhile ole Roy would have a second title with a completely different group of guys, along with a dynasty he built at KU (which btw won a title with players he recruited to Kansas). He appeared in a title game with the Jayhawks as well.
I would put RWill's two titles ahead of Billy Donovan's two (the same team), even though BDon went to a title game with a different crew in 2000.
UConn's two titles (No.3 if he gets one this year) would TO ME put Calhoun past Coach K's three as they were with three different cores at UConn. But UConn doesn't seem to be as storied a program as Duke and UNC. It seems like they are like the Marlins in that they pop up every few seasons and win a title, but you don't hear much from them otherwise.
Finally, Tom Izzo of Michigan State is quite a coach. If he were to snag No.2 I might have to consider putting him on K and Calhoun's level, and past Donovan. Izzo has had MSU in the 99 F4, 01F4, 03? and 05F4. Quite a coach that gets it done. It's never pretty, but he gets it done.
My list right now, tier-wise would be
CLASS A
Coach K (3 titles, 3 losses in title game)
Knight (3 titles)
Calhoun (2 titles)
Dean Smith (2 titles. were there more?)
Class B
Roy Williams (1 title, 1 loss in title game)
Rick Pitino (1 title, 1 loss in title game)
Billy Donovan (2 titles, 1 loss in title game)
Tom Izzo (1 title, multiple F4)
Class C
Tubby, Gary Williams, Bill Self, Jim Boeheim
But I believe that ole Roy Williams career has been just as impressive as Coach K's if Roy is able to snag this title. If he falls short yet again, then I have to say that Williams might drop into Class C of "hey, he got lucky that one time." Coach K is the standard RIGHT NOW, because of sheer numbers but Calhoun would pass him or Izzo or/and Roy would equal him in my opinion with a win next Monday.
4 comments:
The Dook fan would say that the inherent recruiting issues at thier "academic" school outweighs the advantages that Roy gets at North Carolina and Kansas and give that at best a push.
Notice academic is in quotes.. same argument they make at Notre Dame and Georgia Tech for reasons they can't compete.
Shavlik Randolph is no scholar... and last time I checked... neither was Stephon Marbury.
Even as a Carolina fan however... Dean Smith should have won more championships with that talent.
Izzo is fantastic. K is fantastic. Calhoun as well though lets check the ego thier pops... it's your players that win games not you... the fact you got them to sign on the dotted line is more valueable than you drawing stuff on a whiteboard. Hell all of the guys you have listed are very good.
oh, and do we really count the throwing of the game by UNLV as a championship?
I guess in so much as we count Chris Webbers time out.
And I guess I forgot to mention the real reason I'd put Roy about Coach K...Roy's teams were actually good whereas K's teams would have gotten shattered by a solid collection of athletes NOT on the take. Duke with 92 seniors getting EVERY call beat 5 freshmen at Michigan. Then you had Battier flopping like a pair of summer shoes against Arizona. Roy's UNC team in 2005 AND this team (assuming he wins it) could have beaten those teams no question. TALENT TALENT TALENT. Coach K just whines so much that the refs just say "Here Mike. Shut up!"
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